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Fans that can turn you off a band....
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Rockangel



Joined: 28 May 2000
Posts: 1367
Location: A step away from crazy

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2001 4:51 pm    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Even better Metalfilm, no offence to you Fly. But that helped ALOT. I wouln't know much as far as the guitar diffrances go as I only played that instrament foe a couple of years. But I took 7 years of voice and know what you are talking about there. So thank you. It's nice to have someone like you on this board who can reasonably explain things like this. I learned something. [img]http://axl.hardradio.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img]
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Raider



Joined: 12 Aug 1999
Posts: 1286

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2001 5:52 pm    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

fly:

Well, the absolute best way to tell is to listen to them back to back. But in case you don't have the time or inclination:

Death metal tends to go for heaviness in their songs, often use very gutteral vocals (some people like to call them "cookie-monster" vocals). Although lyrical concepts cover the full possible range, from ultra-satanic to Christian lyrics, the genre is most famous for the gore bands, and that lyrical style would not go over well in black metal at all. The exception to this is some of the European scene, particularly Sweden. Besides the increasingly well-known Gothenburg melodic death scene, even their more traditional death metal bands tend not to be as heavy as the American-style, and rather than the "cookie-monster" vocals used more of a yelling-type vocals.

Black metal, on the other hand, usually doesn't concern itself too much with heaviness. There are exceptions, Triumphator and Summon being two good examples, but most black metal bands really aren't that heavy. Many of them go for a dark, "evil" atmosphere. A very select few can do an excellent job of creating an eerie feel about their songs (Anteus and early Gorgoroth being good examples).

Traditional black metal didn't really use keyboards, but keyboards found their way into the genre. Some bands do a great job of using keyboards and staying real black metal, such as earlier Emperor, Graveland, Nokturnal Mortum, and Tartaros. But there are others that just use them to the point that they really aren't even black metal, such as Dimmu Borgir, Cradle of Filth, and Sirius. In itself I think it's cool to not feel the need to conform to a certain standard of what a band is supposed to play, but I do get a little annoyed when those latter bands get referred to as black metal when they just really aren't. And I do like Cradle of Filth and I like Sirius a whole lot, so I don't mean that as an insult to them (in fact, even the members of Sirius don't think they really qualify as black metal, and for the same reasons I said).

Although lyrical concepts do vary, there isn't as much variety as with death metal. And whereas there are some death metal bands out there with very intelligent lyrics, I'm still looking for a black metal band with them.

But some do have interesting lyrics, such as certain bands who use Viking themes for their lyrics (some fail even at this). And many bands use cosmic themes, which although I don't really dig it, at least it isn't stupid like too many bands in this genre.
But I can always ignore the lyrics, because I really don't like the lyrical concepts behind most power metal anyway.

The typical black metal vocals are also significantly differ than typical death vocals. Most black metal vocalists use what sometimes sounds like a shriek, and other times just a high-pitched yell. The good ones can honestly sound like they're possessed by a demon or something.

It's also of note than in the early days of the black metal scene, many black metal bands hated death metal. Fenriz of Darkthrone said it was too "trendy" (of course, it has since been learned that he was really just joking around about a lot of the things he said in the early days of Darkthrone. And when you realize he isn't being serious, he's actually a very humorous guy to read the interviews with). And I even saw an interview with Satyr (of Satyricon), where he honestly threatened an interviewer for asking him if he liked death metal (again, I think he's changed his tune since then). And yes, I also think this attitude is childish and ridiculous, but that very attitude is another thing separating the genres.

So anyway, I guess I've probably told you more than you wanted to hear, so I'll quit now.
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Raider



Joined: 12 Aug 1999
Posts: 1286

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2001 5:53 pm    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Oops, didn't see Metalfilm had replied already.
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Rockangel



Joined: 28 May 2000
Posts: 1367
Location: A step away from crazy

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2001 5:59 pm    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Thanks though Raider. Instead of acting like I know it all already I like to learn what I con from you guys. It's goo to get another take on it though. Makes it pretty clear that this is a known fact in the differances and not an individual opinion. So thanks for the in depth second. [img]http://axl.hardradio.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img]
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Sqweelie



Joined: 21 Feb 2001
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2001 1:40 am    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Wow! You know that tingly feeling you get when you stumble onto kindred spirits? I tuned into HardRadio because I played the pits off of the final Stuck CD and as much as I love it, I don't think I can face another spin of Rage for Order.
Anyway, I fumbled onto this forum and laughed so hard I grew boobs.
Thanks, I needed it.
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Tyrannorabbit



Joined: 04 Oct 2000
Posts: 3985
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2001 2:14 am    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Y'all explained the BM/DM differences well, better than I could (Subtraction, I think you gave BM the best nutshell definition I've heard).

If you want another nutshell definition that's way less reliable, how about this - black metal is death metal with everything two octaves higher.
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Raider



Joined: 12 Aug 1999
Posts: 1286

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2001 1:30 pm    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Damn, I was really screwed up yesterday. Not only did I basically clone Metalfilm's post, I just realized that it was Rockangel, and not Fly, who asked the question originally. I probably sounded like an @ss then, seeming like I was trying to correct Fly rather than answering Rockangel's question.
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Raider



Joined: 12 Aug 1999
Posts: 1286

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2001 1:34 pm    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Damn, I was really screwed up yesterday. Not only did I basically clone Metalfilm's post, I just realized that it was Rockangel, and not Fly, who asked the question originally. I probably sounded like an @ss then, seeming like I was trying to correct Fly rather than answering Rockangel's question.
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Rockangel



Joined: 28 May 2000
Posts: 1367
Location: A step away from crazy

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2001 4:14 pm    Post subject: Fans that can turn you off a band.... Reply with quote

Raider, you just need a vacation. Nice little beach in the South Pacific, pretty lady bringing you drinks. A time to collect your thoughts. [img]http://axl.hardradio.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img]
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