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What do I do when Ozzy dies?
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Raider



Joined: 12 Aug 1999
Posts: 1286

PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 8:43 am    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

Yeah, I think Zod's point was NOT AT ALL bashing '80s metal, or even the bands. I think he's saying something that I feel as well--most of them have used up their ideas. Not really bashing them, no one has an unlimited supply of ideas. Beethoven and Mozart would have run out eventually, especially if they were held to the release schedules that bands go through. But that doesn't change the fact that many of those bands just aren't putting out albums that are worth it anymore. Instead of buying anything new by Priest, I would rather buy the remasters of their old albums (_Stained Class_was in desperate need of a remaster anyway, I can hardly hear the damn thing on my version). And Iron Maiden's newest one may have been decent, but if anyone had heard that album and not know it was Maiden, they would just have said it was OK. Like someone mentioned, we automatically give some of the older bands bonus points just on name recognition.

And Iced Earth and Primal Fear aren't '80s bands, just bands playing '80s-style metal, of which there are actually plenty around now. Just that today they don't get famous outside the metal community like in the old days. Well, in fact, even on some metal boards like this one many of the bands go unknown.
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General Zod



Joined: 24 Jan 2001
Posts: 2519
Location: Krypton

PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 10:14 am    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

Desslar-

As Tyranno and Raider correctly surmised, I wasn't bashing 80's metal. I love 80's metal. I was, however, at least somewhat bashing the metal that 80's artists have put out recently. Some of it's solid. Motley Crue's "New Tattoo" was a nice offering, but it's not "Shout at the Devil". Iron Maiden's "Brave New World" was a decent disc, but it's not exactly "Piece of Mind". I could go on, but I think you get my point. I simply don't think that the artists who dominated the 80's are putting out material that is either on par with their earlier works, or on par with what the younger artists are currently putting out. Just my $0.02.

GZ
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JGunnz1



Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 896
Location: Minneapolis

PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 10:47 am    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

I disagre. I see what you are saying, but I think that there are several bands that have put out material that is just as good as their earlier 80's stuff. WASP's "Unholy Terror" is their best since "The Last Command." Slayer's
"God Hates Us All" is their best since "Seasons." Annhilator's "Carnival Diablos" was their best since "Alice in Hell." Savatage's "Poets and Madmen" is their best since "Gutter Ballet." The list goes on.
There are several bands that are putting out quality material that is on par with their earlier works...just not many. I don't see where we can say that these bands aren't coming up with "original" stuff anymore. I see it as they have developed their own sound, and they are staying true to their own sound. Do we really expect a band to completely change from Album to album? I think people would be pretty unhappy if that were to happen.
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Mijarra



Joined: 28 Nov 2000
Posts: 1564
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 2:01 pm    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

I don't think I made my original point strongly enough. What I was getting at in my original post is that while Ozzy (and, as some mentioned, a few other bands) still produce what I think is quality music, and while some of these bands certainly still have a following and recognition even from younger fans, there seems to be a drop off point at about the age of 35 where you just won't find any younger bands picking up on the genre. So I guess my original point was, when Ozzy (and other bands) moves on, it's all over.

Definately there is a resurgence of '80s type rock/metal, brought on largely by VH1. Certainly some bands are still getting exposure due to this, and we all have our opinions of which bands still "got it". I agree that after 15 or 20 years it's only natural for new ideas to come less frequently and that these bands won't be as cutting edge as they once were. I guess I'm just looking at the big picture and it kinda seems like there is little future out there for melodic rock/metal unless some young bands start picking up the torch.

BTW, this was all brought on by an article I read in this months Guitar One about a band called Course of Nature. It talked about how they did hard rock type cover music and then started writing originals until they gave up the bar circuit and tried to stand on their own music. The article has quotes like "Nobody plays solos anymore but we stick them in all over the place" and says that the guitarists main inspiration was the guys from Skid Row. Needless to say, I got all excited thinking finally there was a new band that I could get into. I went to pick up the CD when it came out, and what do you know they sound kinda like Creed. What a disappointment. So, I guess the world's idea of melodic guitar driven rock is now represented by Creed. So, you see, Ozzy's new CD sounds pretty good by comparison.
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Desslar



Joined: 11 Jul 2001
Posts: 776
Location: Bloomington, IN

PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 2:18 pm    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

quote:
Originally posted by Raider:
And Iced Earth and Primal Fear aren't '80s bands, just bands playing '80s-style metal, of which there are actually plenty around now. Just that today they don't get famous outside the metal community like in the old days. Well, in fact, even on some metal boards like this one many of the bands go unknown.

Not exactly true. Iced Earth's Days of Purgatory CD contains material from the 80s. Primal Fear is made up of members of 80s bands like Sinner and Tyran Pace.
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General Zod



Joined: 24 Jan 2001
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 7:11 pm    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

JGunnz1-

I don't want to start a semantical debate, but I noticed that you used the word "since" alot. As in X is their best album "since" X. And that is just my point; these bands are no longer topping themselves. To me, all that really means is, that they released a lot of sub-standard stuff in between the two releases that you named. Regardless, I still wonder if we aren't subconsciously spotting these bands some extra points for being something we hold dear from our youth.

Look, I obviously don't speak for everyone (and I certainly wasn't trying to). So, if someone feels that "Brave New World" or "Demolition" is Maiden's or Preist's best works ever, or even if they only think it's a very good release, than more power to them. But to me, for MOST of these bands, it has become evident that their best days have past them by. And given their ages, and the legnth of their careers, it only makes sense that it would be so. I mean, how many great CDs does any one artist have in them?

As to the point that Mijarra was making, I don't know where the age is at which you run out of gas. But it definitely seems like there are very few artists who can put out great material indefinitely.

GZ
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JGunnz1



Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 896
Location: Minneapolis

PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2002 9:50 am    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

quote:
JGunnz1-

I don't want to start a semantical debate, but I noticed that you used the word "since" alot. As in X is their best album "since" X. And that is just my point; these bands are no longer topping themselves. To me, all that really means is, that they released a lot of sub-standard stuff in between the two releases that you named. Regardless, I still wonder if we aren't subconsciously spotting these bands some extra points for being something we hold dear from our youth.

You are correct. My point was that there are a lot of 1980's band's that are still putting out quality metal- with misses here and there. Maybe we are subconciously spotting them a few points because of who they are. Some of them have gotten close to topping themselves, but I can't think of any off the bat that did. However, it doesn't have to be an '80's band to release crap every now and then, and I think we may spot points to any band that we fancy. Also, it is my belief that most bands release one or maybe two seminal albums, usually early in their career and then NEVER come close to it again. I DO see what you are saying though.
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iwarrior



Joined: 05 Apr 2002
Posts: 3526
Location: Pittsburgh,PA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2002 5:49 pm    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

I get so tired of people saying that there is no quality out there anymore. Maybe the topic starter should check out MSG's Be Aware Of Scorpions(change that title!). There's tons of reviews on hardradio to guide you.The good stuff is out there,it's just not as easy to find.
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Mijarra



Joined: 28 Nov 2000
Posts: 1564
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2002 6:12 pm    Post subject: What do I do when Ozzy dies? Reply with quote

quote:
Originally posted by iwarrior:
I get so tired of people saying that ther is no quality out there anymore. Maybe the topic starter should check out MSG's Be Aware Of Scorpions(change that title!). There's tons of reviews on hardradio to guide you.The good stuff is out there,it's just not as easy to find.

Michael Schenker is hardly a new performer. Instead of trying to re-explain something I already stated twice, I'm just going to paste a paragraph I wrote before. Quote, from me, the original poster:

"I don't think I made my original point strongly enough. What I was getting at in my original post is that while Ozzy (and, as some mentioned, a few other bands) still produce what I think is quality music, and while some of these bands certainly still have a following and recognition even from younger fans, there seems to be a drop off point at about the age of 35 where you just won't find any younger bands picking up on the genre. So I guess my original point was, when Ozzy (and other bands) moves on, it's all over."

And within "Ozzy (and other bands)" I do include MSG.

It's all up to individual opinion. Maybe you feel that there ARE new bands who are filling the void. I do not. But once again, my point...NEW BANDS!!!
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