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Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_
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Tyrannorabbit



Joined: 04 Oct 2000
Posts: 3985
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2001 4:55 am    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

Picked up these two today, the latter because it came highly recommended, the former because I've heard a lot of praise for it and, despite it being on as big a label as Metal Blade, this is the only time I've ever seen it around and I know from experience that sometimes, if you don't pick up something when you can, you might never see it again. Besides, it's got a great cover.

And I have to say, after listening to _V_ a couple of times, I'm not impressed. Well, maybe that's harsh - there's obviously a lot to be impressed about here. But there are primarily two things which just ruin this one for me: the production, and the keyboards.

The production is muffled, rendering the guitars utterly toothless. Once your guitars are toothless, metal-wise, you're dead in the water, no matter how good your songs are. This is like the opposite of Yngwie's _War To End All Wars_ - instead of guitars being way too far in front, they're way too far in the back.

And the keyboards...hey, I like keys in metal as much as the next guy. Unless the next guy is MarillionFan, but it rarely is. I very much believe that keys, when they're used correctly and well, can add a fine new dimension to a song. And in metal, no time are keys as powerful as the moment you first hear them in part of a song.

This album has exactly two such moments. One is at the very beginning of the album. The next is at the beginning of track TWELVE. There are only thirteen tracks here, and for eleven straight songs, the keys don't stop for even a moment.

The singer takes breaks. The bassist takes breaks, the drummer takes breaks, even the guitarist takes breaks. The keyboardist is so omnipresent, however, that very soon it just becomes obnoxious.

One of the most important things a musician can ever understand is that sometimes, the best thing he can contribute to a song is his silence. If this keyboardist understands that, _V_ is not a good example of this understanding.

What I did like about this, however, are the choir-like harmony vocals, which I understand are actually the band backing up the singer, and not just the multitracked singer (correct me if I'm wrong, though).

Now, Kamelot is a similarly mega-hyped prog-power American band, which I'm sure a lot of you are aware of. Their biggest trump, at least according to the hype, is singer Roy (?) Kahn, who, yes, can sing.

This album, I liked quite a bit more. Not gushingly so, but after _V_, I just wanted something that wouldn't make my teeth itch, and it's nice to hear an album that's really very good.

As for Kahn, for all the hype, and of course the fact that he really can sing, I'm a little underwhelmed, much like I am with so many power metal singers. One can accuse Matthew Barlow of trying too hard, but you can't accuse him of not trying. With Kahn (and many other power metal singers), he sings so effortlessly that one almost gets the impression of him doing this in his sleep, because he probably can. I hate to inch towards the "doing it badly gives it feel" crowd, but with singers, a sense of straining a little higher, lower, louder, quieter, gruffer, cleaner or more emotive than what they're comfortable with is a necessity for me in metal. That's what gives the vocals power, is the effort needed to take things beyond the comfort zone...with Kahn, I'm left with no doubt as to his ability, but where does he push things to the edge? I don't think he does. He sounds so comfortable. Metal at it's best is a lot of things, but it's not comfortable.

I'm not sure if or when I'll pick up another Kamelot album...I like this one, but it'll take some more growing on me yet for me to be completely sold. Symphony X, however...anyone want a used copy of _V_? I'll miss the cover, but I'd love to recover some of what I spent on this thing.
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General Zod



Joined: 24 Jan 2001
Posts: 2519
Location: Krypton

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2001 7:31 am    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

Tyrannorabbit-

I would agree with your description of the production on Symphony X's V. However, I think the real problem with this disc is it's songs. They just don't grab hold of the listener.

Kamelot, on the other hand, will grow on you. Especially Khan's voice. What he does vocally, isn't as obvious as what Barlow does. It will take a few listens before you begin to pick up on all the little things that he does that makes him such an outstanding vocalist. I would definitely like here what you have to say about both Khan and Kamelot after you have owned that disc a few weeks.

I am curious, why would you discriminate against an artist just because they are on Metal Blade, or any other label for that matter? Metal Blade isn't even a major.

I admit, I give preferencial treatment to all of Century Media's artists, but I am never hesitant to buy music by an artist because of what label they are on.

GZ
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Tyrannorabbit



Joined: 04 Oct 2000
Posts: 3985
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2001 1:28 pm    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

I have to admit, T4thL is one of those discs that kinda makes me roll my eyes when I first listen to it, but by the time it's over I find I've enjoyed it a lot.

The Metal Blade comment was nothing against Metal Blade, it was only a comment on the irony of _V_ being on this comparatively major label (of the "metal" labels, I think only Roadrunner's discs are more easily found) but after it's been out for something like a year, this was the first time I ever actually saw it around.

(I prefer CM too, mostly because they have yet to sign any truly horrible acts that I've heard, and they're smart enough to crank out a super-cheap sampler every year which have, in the long run, seriously affected what my favorite bands are today)
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MarillionFan



Joined: 09 Oct 2000
Posts: 443
Location: West Coast

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2001 2:00 pm    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

I just have one thing to say:

HAHAHAHAAHAHAAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHA
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Tyrannorabbit



Joined: 04 Oct 2000
Posts: 3985
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2001 2:22 pm    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

Unsurprisingly, that one thing happens to be...nothing at all. Strange that you'd want to draw attention to it.
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General Zod



Joined: 24 Jan 2001
Posts: 2519
Location: Krypton

PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2001 7:32 am    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

MarillionFan-

OK. I'll ask. What do you find so amusing?


GZ
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Metal1



Joined: 27 May 2000
Posts: 1253
Location: South of Hell

PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2001 7:49 pm    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

I hate to go against Symphony X (better band to date), but Kamelot's Fouth Legacy is more solid. V gets better the more I listen, but I can tell it's no DWOT. I actually rate the Kamelot album up there with Brave New World as far as new CD's go.
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Katalyst



Joined: 28 Aug 2000
Posts: 280

PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2001 10:12 pm    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

Are You fukkin joking?!?!?!

wasn't impressed?

what the hell does it take to impress You?!?!?!

You're on crack You silly fukker

The Grand Design, from V...that song ALONE kicks the living **** outta ANY modern production this year. ANY.

.....at one point I really had to go take a piss and that song came on a progressive metal station I listen to, and I was rooted in place.....utterly paralyzed by its quality

I was just like..."OOOOOOOOOOOOO ! THAT is NICE !"

I swear, the fukkin people on this web board

I mean a LOT of music and art is a matter of taste, but then there are some things that are just fukkin FACTS that, even if a person doesn't like that particular type of art, nobody at least can deny it's a masterpiece.

Like somewhere, on some other part of this board, this TyrannoFukker guy put in his 2 cents about guitarists he doesn't like. Not liking someone, that's okay, whatever. Who fukkin cares if he doesn't like someone or not. But something he wrote's been buggin me for about a week. I was driving my new car to work, and listening to TNT's Intuition album. I remembered Tyranno's "guitarists we don't like" posts and some guy on there, maybe even Tyranno, maybe edison, says that Ronnie LeTekro's overrated.

Now, You may not like Ronni'es playing, or may not be that impressed, even though what they chose to do is just brilliant....but I guess if I have to explain that You wouldn't understand anyway.......but saying he's overrated is just wrong. That's totally wrong terminology.

Go on the streets and ask people if they like Ronnie LeTekro, and I bet tons of money they don't even know who TNT is. Do a search on the web for TNT and see how many hits are actually for the Norwegian Metal band.
Even when people DO know who Ronnie is, they say infantile things like "I think he's just overrated," or, "I'm just not impressed by his playing."

So, at the very least, he's NOT overrated. Reb Beach isn't either. I could go on and on.

I want to get along with people, but really, I go to webboards all the time and just read and mostly what I see are tons of people who really don't think about what they write before hitting the send button. Any old **** flows out of em. It's bad enough they think stupid things like that, but then they go and post it too.


I'm not gonna get started on how the web's accelerated many cultures meeting at once, and all its downfalls, but this thing where kids rattle off about **** like V didn't impress them and Ronnie is overrated just PISSES ME OFF !!!

Goddammit kid ! Symphony X is doin more to bring REAL metal back and at the same time pushing the art form than most pseudobands out these days. All You can say about it is it doesn't impress You.

Fukk
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MarillionFan



Joined: 09 Oct 2000
Posts: 443
Location: West Coast

PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2001 10:38 pm    Post subject: Symphony X's _V_, Kamelot's _The Fourth Legacy_ Reply with quote

That response is EXACTLY why Katalyst is the coolest dude at this board!!

YOU F.UCKING RULE DUDE!!!

I am sick of 'chump' boards too dude (like MMBB and MRBB) come on over to the best board on the net Katalyst.
[url=http://www.***********]www.***********[/url]
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